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See also: https://github.com/jasonmunro/cypht/issues/45

Related: Cypht dev server

Server that Alireza will set up: item67004-cyphtdemo-dogfood2-evoludata-com

Proposals

Usage

  • Demonstrate bugs (before or after reporting)
  • Confirming if a bug is resolved
  • Promotion
    • Help end users adopt Cypht
    • Demonstrate rare features like moving emails from one account to another
  • Compare standalone Cypht vs Cypht within Tiki (tiki-webmail.php) vs Cypht in a wiki page
  • Get screenshots for documentation

URLs and emails

Technology

  • Virtualmin with mail accounts
  • Cypht within Tiki 21.x LTS
  • Cypht within trunk
  • Cypht standalone latest stable
  • Cypht standalone latest master

Risk of abuse

Should be set up to avoid abuse. Maybe a few accounts that can email each other but not mail out (or Mail rate limit)
And receive emails so folks can test how a specific message looks.

Security risks

If users configure demo instance with their real email accounts, the other users could abuse.

Questions

Should be reset once a day or a week?

Potential development

  • Perhaps we'll want a demo mode for Cypht where some features are deactivated. Ex.: to find out what are the IMAP passwords.

Types of users

Community sysadmins and developers

Full access to the server

  • Alireza (lead)
  • Jason
  • Victor
  • Marc
  • Horia
  • Fabio

Community testers

Admin access to Cypht, Tiki and mails servers.

  • Robert Winkler


Community at large

  • Can use the demo site but not see any passwords

Future

  • Also connect to some JMAP accounts
    • Ask for some demo accounts from OpenPaaS, Cyrus, etc.
  • Automated testing


Marc Laporte Sep 24 14:26
I think we should have a demo instance of Cypht for end users to test. Is there anyone in this room that could volunteer to maintain this?

Marc Laporte Sep 24 14:58
(Not Jason who is already doing so much)

Robert Winkler Sep 25 13:16
I could participate in testing.

Marc Laporte Sep 25 20:48
@robert-winkler Thank you! Once we have server, I will take you up on that offer.

Jason Munro Sep 25 20:57
I could potentially host a demo site, but I would need to build some guardrails around expense. I spend about $100 dollars a month to support Cypht which I'm ok with. But a demo site needs some moderation to protect against abuse that I worry about the cost + time :-)

Weston Miller Sep 25 22:49
How many visits do you think the demo site would get per month?

Marc Laporte Sep 25 22:50
I am wondering if we could use Continuous Integration of some sort to build it
We do some very cool things here: https://gitlab.com/tikiwiki/tiki/-/blob/22.x/.gitlab-ci.yml

Marc Laporte Sep 26 02:28
Several hundred, perhaps a few thousand
@jasonmunro Jason we need to focus you on the code and grow the contributor ecosystem. So I don't want you to do this :-)
This is a reasonable, self-contained, low pressure project for a community member. A good sysadmin with some interest in Cypht will be able to automate most of it.
If it's down here and there during the month, it is not a crisis.
So @kk6mrp: What do you have in mind?

Weston Miller Sep 26 12:53
I would also volunteer to host/maintain it as I have plenty of time to do that.

Marc Laporte Sep 26 14:12
@kk6mrp Fantastic!!!

Marc Laporte Sep 26 15:28
@kk6mrp So please start thinking on best way to showcase Cypht's strengths. For sure, it should aggregate messages from multiple IMAP accounts, so users can move messages from one to another. Also should be possible to send email from one to the others.
And receive messages (we can warn users not to send anything confidential)
However, sending out is perhaps too risky for abuse.
You can look at other webmails and check their demos to see how they handle this
As a later step, we could imagine running a few different versions of Cypht. ex. latest stable and latest from master so this can be used by testers to detect any regressions before we release a new version.
If I push my luck, it would be fantastic to use some accounts which support JMAP

Marc Laporte Sep 26 15:37
jasonmunro/cypht#180
Once we have this, our bug report templates should be updates so end users are encouraged to reproduce on demo before filing
And if they have an issue that demo doesn't, it's a hint that a local config difference.

Marc Laporte Sep 26 15:45
We can publicize the demo server settings via something https://doc.tiki.org/Server-Check so end users can compare with own server....

Marc Laporte Sep 26 15:50
@kk6mrp @robert-winkler Your contribution will help Cypht in both visible and invisible ways.

Marc Laporte Sep 26 15:55
@kk6mrp Again pushing my luck, this is a reproducible recipe that folks can easily install their own demo. Perhaps Docker
There is https://github.com/jasonmunro/cypht-docker but that is just webmail

Weston Miller Sep 26 16:23
@marclaporte_gitlab All right, I'll work on putting together something like you describe. I would imagine that would be the most advanced demo of any webmail around.
Running the latest stable release as well as the master shouldn't be an issue.
As for using accounts that support JMAP, would there be any visible difference from the webmail perspective? I'm not really sure I see an advantage there.

Weston Miller Sep 26 16:30
And you may be pushing your luck on the Docker demo, Cypht is already pretty simple to set up as is and it wouldn't be any more useful than the demo you propose

Marc Laporte Sep 26 17:45
About visible difference with JMAP: Jason could confirm, but I suspect none at first. In fact, it will likely not work well because Jason wrote this integration on a pre-released version of the spec. The Cyrus IMAP server has the very latest version of the spec. So this would be a motivation to update Cypht to be inline with the official published spec.

Marc Laporte Sep 26 20:48
Related: jasonmunro/cypht#45

Marc Laporte Sep 26 21:00
"And you may be pushing your luck on the Docker demo". Ok, please proceed as you think. A basic working demo soon is better than a super demo system one day (maybe never because too complex)
Please let us know what you need :-)

Weston Miller Sep 28 20:48
Ok, will do. I will be working on it and let you all know when I'm done.

Robert Winkler Sep 29 10:45
A Docker version would be great stuff.

Marc Laporte Sep 29 12:46
@robert-winkler There is a Docker for Cypht. You mean more a full mail stack?

Robert Winkler Oct 05 09:04
Hi, currently I use the normal install. However, for most self-hosters, the docker version is certainly more attractive.

Marc Laporte Oct 07 15:29
@kk6mrp I am rooting for you!

Marc Laporte Oct 18 01:02
@kk6mrp Any good news soon?

Marc Laporte Oct 18 14:17
More related to Docker: https://github.com/jasonmunro/cypht/issues/180#issuecomment-711349902

Weston Miller Oct 19 12:43
Unfortunately my time is getting used up more than I had initially anticipated. I am still interested in this but I don't see myself having very much time in the for the foreseeable future.

Marc Laporte Oct 19 13:20
Ah that is unfortunate

Marc Laporte Oct 19 22:51
@all: Is there someone else that can step up? (See discussion above about providing a Cypht demo)

Marc Laporte Oct 29
We are still looking for a volunteer to host Cypht demos